Paul Spicer turns down contract
 
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Paul Spicer turns down contractExpand / Collapse
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Posted Thursday, May 15, 2008 9:20 PM




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Last Login: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:05 PM
One player doesnt make a team.  Spicer will play with or without a new contact.  He will not sit out the year.  If he does he forfeits this years salary and I dont know if many teams would touch him next year if he didnt play.

I dont blame him for what he's doing, but I wish he was in camp.  It's still ota's and there is still a long time for the season to start.  I'm holding out  hope for Big Paul.



Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
John Madden

Member of Jaguar nation and season ticket holder since Day 1

Post #525511
Posted Thursday, May 15, 2008 10:13 PM




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Last Login: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 5:34 PM
I hate to say I told you so......Spicer will be cut.



I still love Morten Anderson!
Post #525534
Posted Thursday, May 15, 2008 11:07 PM




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Last Login: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 11:37 PM
It would sure as h*ll stink to see The Spice Man gone, but its something I won't lose my sleep over.  We will be able to move on easily without him.



Dwight  Howard

6'11, 265 lbs

22 years of age.

BEAST

Post #525555
Posted Thursday, May 15, 2008 11:14 PM




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Last Login: Thursday, October 16, 2008 10:23 AM
amit8700 (5/15/2008)
It would sure as h*ll stink to see The Spice Man gone, but its something I won't lose my sleep over.  We will be able to move on easily without him.

I don't think it would be so easy, we have 2 rookies ( promising but yet rookies remember Mario Williams his first 2 years, blown assiments all over the place)

we have a big time play maker in Reggie H. but he is injured, you got Brian Smith who is still injured. you got Hawkins and Mincey but they are both relief players at BEST.

you take SPice out of the equation and we have a BIG ? at DE AND DT. Remember we are all hoping that the stroud hole can be filled. I think the hole at DT will be "eaiser" to fill than the need at DE.



just a fan, I cheer the good and boo the bad.

Post #525559
Posted Friday, May 16, 2008 12:23 AM




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Last Login: Thursday, November 06, 2008 5:23 AM
Spicer is treading on thin ice here. He senses a weakness in both the Jaguars' position and his own position. So he's going all-in, forcing the opponent to make a decision based on scanty information. Will the rookie DEs be starting-material, and if so, how soon is it going to happen? Since the Jags do not yet know the answers, it makes sense for Spicer to force the issue. If the Jags knew for sure that Harvey would be starting by the 5th game and Groves would have a big impact on passing-downs, then they could tell Spicer to walk - but they don't know that and Spicer is trying to bank some bucks before the Jags have a chance to find out.

If you look at it from Spicer's view, say he plays out his current contract,, which has only the 2008 season remaining. By the end of the season, the rookies will probably be making an impact and so in 2009 a 33-year-old Paul Spicer is looking for work on the open market.

Or - if Spicer can force a fat payday this summer, say a 5-7 MIL bonus on a 3 or 4 year deal, then it almost guarantees he is here for at least 2 more years - possibly three. He can retire on is own terms, on a team he likes, and can bank more bonus by trying to get paid now, while he is the team's most reliable DE.

But I seriously doubt it will work.
Post #525574
Posted Friday, May 16, 2008 12:25 AM




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Last Login: Yesterday @ 9:42 PM
Bjagfan (5/15/2008)
JAGFANSINCE94 (5/15/2008)


If he tried that, the Jags would call his bluff. he loses, if he sits out.


Tell that to his agent Drew R. I don't know why players still employ that fool.

Yeah, he's such a fool.  Spicer should hire an agent that gets him the smallest contract he possibly can to help the team, right?

You do understand that it's his agent's job to get him the MAXIMUM amount he can get, right?  Considering the fact that Rosenhaus is one of the best in the business in that regard, who's the fool? 

I always enjoy it when people pull this card and throw hate at agents for basically doing their job well.  How dare they!

As far as Spicer having little or no leverage, think again.  He's got a LOT of leverage in this situation. 

Think about it. 

He's coming off of a career year where his performance both on and off the field was good enough that the coaching staff slapped a 'C' on his jersey. 

He's got PLENTY of leverage when you look at the roster.  The team doesn't exactly have stellar, proven depth at DE behind him.  He has been the most consistent players on the defensive line in recent years, and he has also consistently improved from one season to the next during his time here.  His improvement was notable enough that he was the last man standing when the team decided to part ways with Hugh Douglas AND Tony Brackens in the same off season.  

If he sticks to his position and forces the team to make a difficult decision, they're left with 2 rookies, a guy with a broken hip, a guy with two surgically corrected Achilles tendons, 3 unproven backups that spent a good portion of last season on the practice squad or on the IR, and a couple of DPRs that are basically undersized ends / linebackers. 

MAYBE the rookies can step in and have an immediate and substantive impact.  Or, MAYBE those rookies will have to endure the normal learning curve that affects most guys entering the league. 

MAYBE Hayward rebounds completely from his Achilles injury/surgeries.  Or, MAYBE he doesn't buck the trend, and never gets quite back to where he was prior to the injury. 

MAYBE Brian Smith rebounds from his broken hip that has prevented him from doing anything other than trotting on the sideline since being drafted by the Jaguars in 2007.  Or, MAYBE he will continue to struggle with an injury because his work ethic is on par with Matt Jones.

MAYBE Wyche/Pettway/Mincey can fill the Spicer role.  Or, MAYBE they'll be in the same spot that they were in last year. 

The bottom line is pretty simple.  The team is better with Spicer than without.  Some say they wouldn't lose any sleep if he was gone.  That's good because you'll have plenty of time to rest come January when the team is sitting home for the post season because Spicer wasn't given a contract bump.  He's more critical to the success of this team than some of you realize.  He understands this, and he is attempting to cash in on that value.

With the team on the cusp of a season that could be a special one, letting one of the vital cogs on your roster linger with contract issues, opting to play hardball and not pay the man what he's worth would seem to be contrary to what this team needs right now. 

The team obviously agrees with that sentiment, or they wouldn't have made an offer to begin with. 



Voted the #1 A-Hole on Jaguars.com

Never argue with idіots. They drag you down to their level, & beat you with experience.

Post #525575
Posted Friday, May 16, 2008 12:38 AM




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Last Login: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 10:32 AM
Spicer also has added value in that you can move him inside on passing downs when you bring in your edge rushers or DPR's.



The four pronged approach to winning football:
1.) Beat them to the punch.
2.) Offense sells tickets; defense wins championships.
3.) Run the ball and stop the run.
4.) There is no I in team.
Post #525577
Posted Friday, May 16, 2008 2:42 AM




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Last Login: Monday, August 11, 2008 7:21 PM
I'd like to state that I think it's in the Jaguars best interests to sign Spicer to any reasonable contract offer.  I believe he's earned more money.

That said, I really don't see the team caving to demands that they deem to be unwarranted.  They have a deal in place with Spicer.  While no other player on the roster can do what Spicer does, we aren't up a creek without him.  Is anyone losing sleep over a 1st & 2nd down lineup of Hayward & Harvey at DE?  What about 3rd down with Harvey and Groves?

I think he's due more cash after the job he did last season, but exactly how much is the question.



Those Who Stay Will Be Champions

Post #525581
Posted Friday, May 16, 2008 4:21 AM




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Last Login: 2 days ago @ 4:50 PM
maize n blue (5/16/2008)
I'd like to state that I think it's in the Jaguars best interests to sign Spicer to any reasonable contract offer.  I believe he's earned more money.

That said, I really don't see the team caving to demands that they deem to be unwarranted.  They have a deal in place with Spicer.  While no other player on the roster can do what Spicer does, we aren't up a creek without him.  Is anyone losing sleep over a 1st & 2nd down lineup of Hayward & Harvey at DE?  What about 3rd down with Harvey and Groves?

I think he's due more cash after the job he did last season, but exactly how much is the question.

 

The big questionmark in all of this is Reggie Hayward. I'm even wondering if Spicer knows something about Hayward's injury being worse than he's letting on, and is perhaps holding out knowing this. But that's sheer speculation on my part. But I do keep wondering if Hayward might be back now that he's two years removed from his injury. But then I think, even if he is, he almost has to command a starting position to be worth his base salary, and I'm always left with thinking there's no way he beats out Spicer. But now, with Spicer holding out, I'm not so sure. I keep reading that Hayward is working out like a madman determined to start. If Hayward can prove that he's back, maybe he deserves the contract extension and starting LDE role instead of Spicer.

Now I'm not holding my breath that Hayward will be able to prove as much, but it's getting interesting. Should Hayward edge out Spicer, I imagine the Jaguars should be able to pick up a 4th or 5th round pick for him. I'd hate to lose Spicer, but hold-outs like this often end sour. Teams never want to give in too quickly to someone holding out because that only inspires others to do so. Jimmy Smith held out until mere days before the Regular Season began.



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Post #525591
Posted Friday, May 16, 2008 5:23 AM




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Last Login: Tuesday, November 04, 2008 11:43 PM
shag52 (5/15/2008)
"No, he doesn't hold out long term. He has no leverage."

If you don't think he has no leverage then you better think again... the Jags have a "high" dollar DE whos playing on one leg... they have two rookies who have NEVER taken the first snap in the NFL and they let a DE walk who has had more sacks than ANY Jaguar DE in the last several years...

 

If they thought Spicer was indispensible, they wouldn't have taken those two DE's in the draft. That's why they offered him what they did. They know what his services are worth. They can't pay him AND a first round pick big money.

Post #525597
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