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RE: Harvey the only one....

jj82284 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 17:37:00 GMT

[quote][b]Titanjag (8/8/2008)[/b][hr]Explain that. I think any jag fan knows how precious time it is to be on top. Ou team faltered when we were top dogs in 99. Well its our time again and I want Harvey in here helping us get to and win a SB now. We gave up alot to get this kid and the crap that has happened so far is BS to me. I am getting teed off about it more so every day.[/quote]

are we up against the cap? that was the cse with the 99 team.

RE: Harvey the only one....

flapeds — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 17:28:31 GMT

[quote][b]FBT (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]Harvey will sign. When that happens is up to him. I don't see him continuing this hold out indefinitely. More than likely you will see movement before the end of this week now that the final deal is done and there's a point of reference to work with for the team.

Harvey isn't going to miss out on a paycheck to make a point here. Neither will his agent.[/quote]

TICK ... TICK ... TICK.... End of the week. No Harvey. Jaguars 1 Harvey 0

I guarantee you Harvey's agent will get less than he wants and the Jags will pay more than they want. WINNER: Jags fans.

RE: Harvey the only one....

FBT — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 13:47:20 GMT

Alfie when you trade three picks to get into the top 8 the guy is supposed to make an impact. He is making a huge impact but not the kind any of us want. And yes I did expect him to deepen our DE rotation. We need the guy in and now he wont make any impact until the second half of the season. That stinks.[/quote]

Yeah, that would really stink to have Harvey starting to hit his stride in the second half of the season when the team is making their run. That would really stink.

Why are you taking it personally?

You do understand that the NFL is a business, right?

RE: Harvey the only one....

Alfie — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:55:20 GMT

[quote][b]Titanjag (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Alfie (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Titanjag (8/8/2008)[/b][hr]The Jags and Harvey's agent have not spoken for 7 calendar days now. I wish we would have stayed at 25 and not moved up for this guy. Even if he comes in he dont anything this yr. What a waste of three draft picks for this guy.[/quote]

Is he going to miss all 16 games if he signs next week or something?

What were you expecting from this kid if he was in camp? 10 sacks?[/quote]

Alfie when you trade three picks to get into the top 8 the guy is supposed to make an impact. He is making a huge impact but not the kind any of us want. And yes I did expect him to deepen our DE rotation. We need the guy in and now he wont make any impact until the second half of the season. That stinks.[/quote]

So, is he going to be inactive or what?

Derrick Harvey's job is to rush the passer. I'm not sure how much practice time he needs to learn that.

RE: Harvey the only one....

jtmoney — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:49:46 GMT

Your putting to much emotion into it. It's a business. It is what it is. Time is precious, but it's not as if this team can't be succesful without him. Plus, he'll probably make a bigger impact torwards the latter part of the season anyways, which is when we'll be making our run. Believe me, I understand what you're saying and want him in camp as badly as you do, but you have to let the negotiations run its course. The problem isn't so much the agent or the Jags organization. It's the system that is causing this and the Jags are the ones standing up against it. I can't fault them for that. The agent may be hurting his client if they don't agree on something in the coming week.

RE: Harvey the only one....

jj82284 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:40:11 GMT

dude, its week one of the pre-season. i share your concern about his development, but he would have missed more time with a sprained ankle and a signed contract.

the impact that you draft for in the top ten is early by comparision bust still in ears 2-3 on. every pick requires development and that developmental process overall is not going to be that affected by these little hold outs. like vic said he has been there all offseason throguh conditioning and otas that are as of now almost like the training camp practices that he will have missed.

to me, with the overall thud tempo of practices in training camps the actual preseason games for a young guy are more important for developing game speed. he will most likely miss this one and probably the next one. in the third preseason game he will probably play the entire second half of the game and almost three quarters until his tongue is falling out in the final preseason game. you want him ready for 20-25 snaps opening day.

rookies take until mid season to gel anyway. i am not willing to risk the longterm future of this football team by signing a bad deal just to save a few weeks.

let's not get overly emotionally involved in this process. this is about business and money, not how he feels about this team. there is a gator starting at free safety, mike, and soon to be strong side end. this is a great atmosphere for him, close to him, and a contender. it is the dream of every top ten pick to go to a contender that trades up.

RE: Harvey the only one....

oface5446 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:37:43 GMT

We will make a push with or without Harvey.

What's that they say about not getting upset about that which you cannot control?

RE: Harvey the only one....

Titanjag — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:33:49 GMT

Explain that. I think any jag fan knows how precious time it is to be on top. Ou team faltered when we were top dogs in 99. Well its our time again and I want Harvey in here helping us get to and win a SB now. We gave up alot to get this kid and the crap that has happened so far is BS to me. I am getting teed off about it more so every day.

RE: Harvey the only one....

oface5446 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:25:10 GMT

[quote][b]Titanjag (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Alfie (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Titanjag (8/8/2008)[/b][hr]The Jags and Harvey's agent have not spoken for 7 calendar days now. I wish we would have stayed at 25 and not moved up for this guy. Even if he comes in he dont anything this yr. What a waste of three draft picks for this guy.[/quote]

Is he going to miss all 16 games if he signs next week or something?

What were you expecting from this kid if he was in camp? 10 sacks?[/quote]Alfie when you teade three picks to get into the top 8 the guy is supposed to make an impact. He is making a huge impact but not the kind any of us want. And yes I did expect him to deepen our DE rotation. We need the guy in and now he wont make any impact until the second half of the season. That stinks.[/quote]

Harvey is just as much about the future as he is the present.

RE: Harvey the only one....

Titanjag — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:20:33 GMT

[quote][b]Alfie (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Titanjag (8/8/2008)[/b][hr]The Jags and Harvey's agent have not spoken for 7 calendar days now. I wish we would have stayed at 25 and not moved up for this guy. Even if he comes in he dont anything this yr. What a waste of three draft picks for this guy.[/quote]

Is he going to miss all 16 games if he signs next week or something?

What were you expecting from this kid if he was in camp? 10 sacks?[/quote]

RE: Harvey the only one....

Krayz_Jville_D — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:07:08 GMT

[quote][b]MRomeo (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]jj82284 (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]JT Jag (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]This doesn't help our situation at all. Rivers' contract is remarkably similar to Mayo's, and Ellis' is remarkably similar to Gholston's. We want to give Harvey a contract similar to Rivers and Harvey wants a contract similar to Ellis'.

Who blinks first?[/quote]

i said this in another thread, and i will say it again. last year jamaal anderson a pass rushing defensive end was selected with the 8th overall pick.

he got a contract worth i believe about 30 million dollars.

harvey should be shooting for 35-7 within reason for inflation not regarding what happened at 6.

then you look at 7 and 9. they average out to just around the mid thrities for the 8th pick.

and when you look at the OUTRAGEOUS DEALS its the same reason that the raiders had to pay walker so muhc money and mcfadden so much money. its the bad team tax. the jags had the highest pick of any superbowl contending team. the patriots provided a great backstop for the top ten contracts because they are the patriots. the bengals still have carson palmer and they are going to be in the playoff hunt. those contracts are reasonable because they are not having to pay the bad team tax.

the deal should be a compromise of 7 and 9 and it will probably average out to what we would have paid with an increase from last years 8 pick anyway.

the bad news is no longer the contract in my oppinion. harvey will probably miss two preseason games at the most and then be a role player until midseason this year. if he is where he needs to be in december then it really doesn't matter because with this scheme of defense we can hold the line with the guys we have and the talent in the back.

what concerns me is the performance of andrson. anderson was another one of those guys who had the skill set to get after the passer, but he is so big and strong that he plays the run well enough to line up on th strongside. the falcons play on turf and he got considerable playing time last year. the kid didn't have a single sack, i mean one. they are talking about altering scheme to get him to the QB and moving him inside on thidrd down. when you draft a kid in the top ten and you are talking about moving him to a nonpremium position at money time then you know that there is something wrong.

at this level the hands of the offensive linman are much much faster, their feet are better, and their technique is close to perfect. it takes a while for even the best pass rushers to tweak their games with moves counters, speed rushes etc. to be dominant at this level. i think that the risk of having a guy like harvey come in and be expected to be a dominant pass rusher from the left side right away is more of a concern than his contract. with the madness at 6 this was almost supposed to happen.[/quote]

That's exactly what I tried to point out to people. Look at Jamaal Anderson from last year. Same exact drafted position, and got nothing. What's even scarier about Jamaal Anderson is people were double-teaming Haynesworth last year so I'm sure he wasn't the focus of the offensive line.

I think the ball is in the Jaguars court. The DE position isn't looking as weak as previously thought, so I'm sure the Jaguars are much less inclined to pay Harvey what he wants. I think the Jaguars are sticking Harvey to a contract much like the Cincy deal. And it's going to be up to him to take it or leave it. Sounds like they are tens of millions of dollars away.

It sucks we lost 3 draft picks over this, I hope he signs. But, for the future of the jaguars I'd rather they sign the right deal for the teams future. And if that means he doesn't sign. So be it.

Just my thoughts.

M[/quote]

Jamaal anderson plays for the falcons, not the titans

RE: Harvey the only one....

MalcolmTen — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:05:53 GMT

[quote][b]Jagwyer (8/8/2008)[/b][hr]Harvey is going to get what the Jags offered him. Vance not making a call to the agent in 7 days indicates that.

If I were Vance I would call his agent with even a lower deal than what is currently on the table. Due to lost practice time and possibility of contribution he is actually going to give because of it.

Vance stick to your guns brother, they will cave and leave room for actual contributors to this team i.e. MJD, Reggie.[/quote]

I hope you're right, my season ticket prices and parking have more than doubled since 1995 and I have to believe player salaries had "a little" something to with that. I have to wonder if Harvey is worth creating a locker room of disgruntled players who think they should be paid more than an untested rookie.

RE: Harvey the only one....

jj82284 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:05:08 GMT

[quote][b]lizzight (8/8/2008)[/b][hr]I really don't see the hype over Harvey anyway. I don't watch alot of college football and I didn't look at his combine numbers (he had to have been good to be pick at the number 8 spot) and I am sure there are Gator fans on here that will dispute me when I say when I did watch the few tapes of him at the combine and watched his interviews and the he walked and talked he looks clumsy and dumb. I think if I was the Jaguars I would have stayed at the 27th pick, picked up Groves and another DE in the second round or vice versa. Or better yet I am sure we could have just traded for Taylor and picked up Groves. It seems as if he is asking for way to much as if he thinks he is going to come in here and get Garrard money. Wow unbelievable!!!

I know it is contradicting myself but what is going to become of the Jaguars of the future if we can't play our players top money to stay like other teams will and have?[/quote]

the one thing i would caution everyone on is that this is a longterm process. mario williams was considered a waste of a pick until he suddenly came on and lit it up for 14 sacks. that position takes a lot of adjustment at this level. so i am not going to go out and say it was a waste of a pick.

this years crop was so weak. i mean you had cambelle who only did 16 reps and ran slower than DT's. there are better job interviews given at mcdonalds. merling had injury problems and has never been considered a DOMINANT edge rusher, groves was small, coming off an injury, and had a heart issue, lawrenece jackson out of USC was another of those guys who didn't project as a double digit sacker.

when yoiu look at harvey he was definately in my oppinion the second end behind long for a 4-3 scheme. he has the strength and has unreal athletacism from the observations of jeff lagamen who played the position.

the idea of keeping him at strongside is a great one because it will allow groves to grow into a starting end and not have to deal with double teams.

RE: Harvey the only one....

JaxFlJon — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:00:21 GMT

I don't know any Harvey on the Jags roster...

RE: Harvey the only one....

Jville808 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:58:55 GMT

who is this Derrick Harvey guy you people speak of?

RE: Harvey the only one....

lizzight — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:53:08 GMT

I really don't see the hype over Harvey anyway. I don't watch alot of college football and I didn't look at his combine numbers (he had to have been good to be pick at the number 8 spot) and I am sure there are Gator fans on here that will dispute me when I say when I did watch the few tapes of him at the combine and watched his interviews and the he walked and talked he looks clumsy and dumb. I think if I was the Jaguars I would have stayed at the 27th pick, picked up Groves and another DE in the second round or vice versa. Or better yet I am sure we could have just traded for Taylor and picked up Groves. It seems as if he is asking for way to much as if he thinks he is going to come in here and get Garrard money. Wow unbelievable!!!

I know it is contradicting myself but what is going to become of the Jaguars of the future if we can't play our players top money to stay like other teams will and have?

RE: Harvey the only one....

MRomeo — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:47:02 GMT

[quote][b]jj82284 (8/8/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]JT Jag (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]This doesn't help our situation at all. Rivers' contract is remarkably similar to Mayo's, and Ellis' is remarkably similar to Gholston's. We want to give Harvey a contract similar to Rivers and Harvey wants a contract similar to Ellis'.

Who blinks first?[/quote]

i said this in another thread, and i will say it again. last year jamaal anderson a pass rushing defensive end was selected with the 8th overall pick.

he got a contract worth i believe about 30 million dollars.

harvey should be shooting for 35-7 within reason for inflation not regarding what happened at 6.

then you look at 7 and 9. they average out to just around the mid thrities for the 8th pick.

and when you look at the OUTRAGEOUS DEALS its the same reason that the raiders had to pay walker so muhc money and mcfadden so much money. its the bad team tax. the jags had the highest pick of any superbowl contending team. the patriots provided a great backstop for the top ten contracts because they are the patriots. the bengals still have carson palmer and they are going to be in the playoff hunt. those contracts are reasonable because they are not having to pay the bad team tax.

the deal should be a compromise of 7 and 9 and it will probably average out to what we would have paid with an increase from last years 8 pick anyway.

the bad news is no longer the contract in my oppinion. harvey will probably miss two preseason games at the most and then be a role player until midseason this year. if he is where he needs to be in december then it really doesn't matter because with this scheme of defense we can hold the line with the guys we have and the talent in the back.

what concerns me is the performance of andrson. anderson was another one of those guys who had the skill set to get after the passer, but he is so big and strong that he plays the run well enough to line up on th strongside. the falcons play on turf and he got considerable playing time last year. the kid didn't have a single sack, i mean one. they are talking about altering scheme to get him to the QB and moving him inside on thidrd down. when you draft a kid in the top ten and you are talking about moving him to a nonpremium position at money time then you know that there is something wrong.

at this level the hands of the offensive linman are much much faster, their feet are better, and their technique is close to perfect. it takes a while for even the best pass rushers to tweak their games with moves counters, speed rushes etc. to be dominant at this level. i think that the risk of having a guy like harvey come in and be expected to be a dominant pass rusher from the left side right away is more of a concern than his contract. with the madness at 6 this was almost supposed to happen.[/quote]

That's exactly what I tried to point out to people. Look at Jamaal Anderson from last year. Same exact drafted position, and got nothing. What's even scarier about Jamaal Anderson is people were double-teaming Haynesworth last year so I'm sure he wasn't the focus of the offensive line.

I think the ball is in the Jaguars court. The DE position isn't looking as weak as previously thought, so I'm sure the Jaguars are much less inclined to pay Harvey what he wants. I think the Jaguars are sticking Harvey to a contract much like the Cincy deal. And it's going to be up to him to take it or leave it. Sounds like they are tens of millions of dollars away.

It sucks we lost 3 draft picks over this, I hope he signs. But, for the future of the jaguars I'd rather they sign the right deal for the teams future. And if that means he doesn't sign. So be it.

Just my thoughts.

M

RE: Harvey the only one....

Jagwyer — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:35:41 GMT

Harvey is going to get what the Jags offered him. Vance not making a call to the agent in 7 days indicates that.

If I were Vance I would call his agent with even a lower deal than what is currently on the table. Due to lost practice time and possibility of contribution he is actually going to give because of it.

Vance stick to your guns brother, they will cave and leave room for actual contributors to this team i.e. MJD, Reggie.

RE: Harvey the only one....

Alfie — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:35:02 GMT

[quote][b]Titanjag (8/8/2008)[/b][hr]The Jags and Harvey's agent have not spoken for 7 calendar days now. I wish we would have stayed at 25 and not moved up for this guy. Even if he comes in he dont anything this yr. What a waste of three draft picks for this guy.[/quote]

Is he going to miss all 16 games if he signs next week or something?

What were you expecting from this kid if he was in camp? 10 sacks?

RE: Harvey the only one....

Titanjag — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:30:36 GMT

The Jags and Harvey's agent have not spoken for 7 calendar days now. I wish we would have stayed at 25 and not moved up for this guy. Even if he comes in he wont do anything this yr. What a waste of three draft picks for this guy.

RE: Harvey the only one....

JaxFlJon — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 09:08:57 GMT

My guestimation indicates Harvey should get a

17.5mil signing bonus and a 5yr-36mil contract.

RE: Harvey the only one....

jj82284 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 09:06:38 GMT

[quote][b]JT Jag (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]This doesn't help our situation at all. Rivers' contract is remarkably similar to Mayo's, and Ellis' is remarkably similar to Gholston's. We want to give Harvey a contract similar to Rivers and Harvey wants a contract similar to Ellis'.

Who blinks first?[/quote]

i said this in another thread, and i will say it again. last year jamaal anderson a pass rushing defensive end was selected with the 8th overall pick.

he got a contract worth i believe about 30 million dollars.

harvey should be shooting for 35-7 within reason for inflation not regarding what happened at 6.

then you look at 7 and 9. they average out to just around the mid thrities for the 8th pick.

and when you look at the OUTRAGEOUS DEALS its the same reason that the raiders had to pay walker so muhc money and mcfadden so much money. its the bad team tax. the jags had the highest pick of any superbowl contending team. the patriots provided a great backstop for the top ten contracts because they are the patriots. the bengals still have carson palmer and they are going to be in the playoff hunt. those contracts are reasonable because they are not having to pay the bad team tax.

the deal should be a compromise of 7 and 9 and it will probably average out to what we would have paid with an increase from last years 8 pick anyway.

the bad news is no longer the contract in my oppinion. harvey will probably miss two preseason games at the most and then be a role player until midseason this year. if he is where he needs to be in december then it really doesn't matter because with this scheme of defense we can hold the line with the guys we have and the talent in the back.

what concerns me is the performance of andrson. anderson was another one of those guys who had the skill set to get after the passer, but he is so big and strong that he plays the run well enough to line up on th strongside. the falcons play on turf and he got considerable playing time last year. the kid didn't have a single sack, i mean one. they are talking about altering scheme to get him to the QB and moving him inside on thidrd down. when you draft a kid in the top ten and you are talking about moving him to a nonpremium position at money time then you know that there is something wrong.

at this level the hands of the offensive linman are much much faster, their feet are better, and their technique is close to perfect. it takes a while for even the best pass rushers to tweak their games with moves counters, speed rushes etc. to be dominant at this level. i think that the risk of having a guy like harvey come in and be expected to be a dominant pass rusher from the left side right away is more of a concern than his contract. with the madness at 6 this was almost supposed to happen.

RE: Harvey the only one....

Sec105fan — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 06:30:23 GMT

Based on what I read in today's T/U, it appears that negotiations (or lack thereof) have finally reached a stalemate. The Jags apparently have made an offer that "fully compensates" Harvey, while admitting that it's below what "the market" would dictate. Harvey, and his agent of course, are holding out for that market number. Who will cave in, if anyone? I think the Jags hold the better hand in this deal, albeit very slightly. Harvey's value as a player, if he holds out the entire year, will almost definitely be lower next year after a year of inactivity. If he's drafted lower next year, he makes less money. Expect Harvey to eventually sign, express his gratitude at getting back to playing ball, and play as a disgruntled multi-millionaire.

RE: Harvey the only one....

oface5446 — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 01:38:13 GMT

[quote][b]I'm James Lipton (8/7/2008)[/b][hr]I've seen a bunch of people blame this on the salary cap. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the salary cap isn't a problem. It goes up exponentially every year and the recent years it's been zooming up even faster, which is why the owners opted out of their contract. Apparently there won't even be a cap in a couple years. I think it's more likely that the Jaguars are feeling the squeeze of being a lower revenue team. Last I heard they were somewhere around 110 million in debt, and looking for minority investors. Shelling out a 20 million guarantee to a rookie isn't something they can afford to do.[/quote]

[url=http://football.calsci.com/SalaryCap.html]On cap/sharing.[/url]

I hear what you're saying, and I don't know right where we are with the cap, but the Jags didn't move up to the 8th round pick without the money to pay for it.

To clarify, the 110 million in debt is independent of the player's salaries. Probably due to not selling enough club seats, not jacking up the price of beers high enough, not selling enough enough regular seats, not having the naming rights sold, whatever, it does not play into what the Jags can or cannot afford to do in free agency/draft or player salary in general.

Anyways, the team is worth about 800 million.

And all that debt can be paid off with a little luck, sweat, perservance and our support.

Or by selling some minority shares.

If we can strike a fair deal (in the context of being a top 10 pick in the 2008 NFL Draft--that means big money for a rookie regardless of how you feel about it) and Harvey produces, then the Jaguars have done exactly what they set out to do and what everyone was crying for them to do: address the pass rush in a big way.

RE: Harvey the only one....

I'm James Lipton — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 23:12:43 GMT

I've seen a bunch of people blame this on the salary cap. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the salary cap isn't a problem. It goes up exponentially every year and the recent years it's been zooming up even faster, which is why the owners opted out of their contract. Apparently there won't even be a cap in a couple years. I think it's more likely that the Jaguars are feeling the squeeze of being a lower revenue team. Last I heard they were somewhere around 110 million in debt, and looking for minority investors. Shelling out a 20 million guarantee to a rookie isn't something they can afford to do.

RE: Harvey the only one....

Buckethead — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 21:13:24 GMT

[quote][b]jagutopia (8/7/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]FBT (8/5/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]ThanksJags (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]FBT,

In your opinion, if Harvey signs this week, would he be playing in the second preseason game?[/quote]

They're not going to keep him out of the mix, but his impact is going to be limited because of all the missed time. Practicing against chairs inhis hotel isn't really preparing him for the NFL.[/quote]

Unless of course the Jags are playing Houston, and Ephriam Salam is the tackle. In that case, it's very fitting.[/quote]That's a little unfair jagutopia, comparing Salam to a chair... Clearly, he is more fittingly compared to a turnstile.

With the protection a chair offers, David Carr could have been a contender!

RE: Harvey the only one....

Utopia — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:27:05 GMT

[quote][b]FBT (8/5/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]ThanksJags (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]FBT,

In your opinion, if Harvey signs this week, would he be playing in the second preseason game?[/quote]

They're not going to keep him out of the mix, but his impact is going to be limited because of all the missed time. Practicing against chairs in his hotel isn't really preparing him for the NFL.[/quote]

Unless of course the Jags are playing Houston, and Ephriam Salam is the tackle. In that case, it's very fitting.

RE: Harvey the only one....

ThanksJags — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:23:10 GMT

[quote][b]StraightJacketJag (8/7/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]ThanksJags (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Jakobe911 (8/6/2008)[/b][hr]

M[/quote]

What's this "we" all about? I don't pay his salary and neither do you. [/quote]

so what does pay the player salaries, all of that money from beer sales?? :D[/quote]

We buy tickets, merchandise and everything else (including beer) because we love the game and want to be lose to the action not because we are purchasing a right to decide what players are paid. [/quote]

I just read all this guys crap .. and im willing to be he is not even a season ticket holder .. stop wasting your time guys[/quote]

He's right! Don't waste your time.

PS I have four season tickets.

RE: Harvey the only one....

StraightJacketJag — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 16:54:07 GMT

[quote][b]ThanksJags (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Jakobe911 (8/6/2008)[/b][hr]

M[/quote]

What's this "we" all about? I don't pay his salary and neither do you. [/quote]

so what does pay the player salaries, all of that money from beer sales?? :D[/quote]

I just read all this guys crap .. and im willing to be he is not even a season ticket holder .. stop wasting your time guys

RE: Harvey the only one....

MRomeo — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 13:24:36 GMT

[quote][b]ThanksJags (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]MRomeo (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]ThanksJags (8/5/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]mcol126 (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]I think this is a metaphor for the 2009-2009 season: The Jaguars will be the last man standing.[/quote]

I like it.

Honestly, I hope they overpaid Rivers so there is only a small window between 7 and 9. It could force the jags to accept the price tag and move on.[/quote]

You have to be kidding me. Don't you understand what it means if the jags are forced to accept the price tag of the #7 pick?

Jones-Drew is up for a new contract after next year, if we pay #7 pick money, guess what there's no money to pay MJD. Or money to pay Reggie Williams, or any of the other players coming up for a contract in the next year or two.

Why should we be willing to sacrifice the future of this team for one player who has yet to prove himself? Makes no sense to me.

Explain if you will what benefit to the JAGUARS it will be to sign Derrick Harvey to a huge contract? What do you think the long term benefits and risks and rewards might be.

M[/quote]

What's this "we" all about? I don't pay his salary and neither do you. All I truly care about on Sunday is having the best players on the field. We can apply our personal opinions and emotions to off the field issues, but a win makes it all good. The Jags felt that Harvey can be the guy tofilla void from last year. IMO, a Superbowl win ispriceless as a fan, for the Jags and for the city. Do whatever it takes to get therightteam in place.If you want to be "elite"in todays NFL you have to pay "elite" money.[/quote]

No, you don't have to pay "elite" money to have a great team. Look at what the jaguars did last year without a single player nominated to the pro bowl(FT got in because of an injury). The Jags are a small market team, that means they don't have the money to spend unwisely. And that's what you're recommending, an unwise decision for immediate gratification. Much like the problems we're having now in the credit crisis. Let's all buy the biggest houses we can, and worry about how to pay for it later.

I think your rationalization is shallow and very short-sighted. I want the jags to win a Super Bowl as much as the next guy. But, I'm not willing to put all my money on one bet in hopes that it pays off. Especially if I KNOW it's going to not allow me to pay my mortgage next month(i.e.- pay guys like MJD when their contract comes due).

M

RE: Harvey the only one....

ThanksJags — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 14:25:27 GMT

[quote][b]Jakobe911 (8/6/2008)[/b][hr]

M[/quote]

What's this "we" all about? I don't pay his salary and neither do you. [/quote]

so what does pay the player salaries, all of that money from beer sales?? :D[/quote]

We buy tickets, merchandise and everything else (including beer) because we love the game and want to be lose to the action not because we are purchasing a right to decide what players are paid.

RE: Harvey the only one....

SicilianJag — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 14:22:36 GMT

"What's this "we" all about? I don't pay his salary and neither do you. All I truly care about on Sunday is having the best players on the field."

I can't believe that anyone that was a fan through the cap he11 days wouldn't figure fiscal responsibility pretty heavily into the equation. I don't want my team to give up the future for one shot at putting the "best players" on the field. The Redskins haven't been very successful with that strategy during the Snyder years.

RE: Harvey the only one....

JagGuy — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 14:19:32 GMT

Harvey signs by the weekend.

RE: Harvey the only one....

ThanksJags — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 13:54:45 GMT

[quote][b]Gabe (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]ThanksJags (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]MRomeo (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]ThanksJags (8/5/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]mcol126 (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]I think this is a metaphor for the 2009-2009 season: The Jaguars will be the last man standing.[/quote]

I like it.

Honestly, I hope they overpaid Rivers so there is only a small window between 7 and 9. It could force the jags to accept the price tag and move on.[/quote]

You have to be kidding me. Don't you understand what it means if the jags are forced to accept the price tag of the #7 pick?

Jones-Drew is up for a new contract after next year, if we pay #7 pick money, guess what there's no money to pay MJD. Or money to pay Reggie Williams, or any of the other players coming up for a contract in the next year or two.

Why should we be willing to sacrifice the future of this team for one player who has yet to prove himself? Makes no sense to me.

Explain if you will what benefit to the JAGUARS it will be to sign Derrick Harvey to a huge contract? What do you think the long term benefits and risks and rewards might be.

M[/quote]

What's this "we" all about? I don't pay his salary and neither do you. All I truly care about on Sunday is having the best players on the field. We can apply our personal opinions and emotions to off the field issues, but a win makes it all good. The Jags felt that Harvey can be the guy to fill a void from last year. IMO, a Superbowl win is priceless as a fan, for the Jags and for the city. Do whatever it takes to get the right team in place. If you want to be "elite" in todays NFL you have to pay "elite" money. [/quote]

He'll be getting elite money....don't worry about it. Just how much of that elite money is on the table for discussion...and I respect the Jags for not budging. There has to be middle ground, and to discount that shows a lack of understanding of the negotiation process.[/quote]

You are correct.

I don't think that a full undertanding of contract negotiation is a requirement for being a fan. It is all very interesting, and great to talk about during the offseason. Based on what everyone is saying, the issue is over a few million. I won't pretend to understand how a few million now will destroy the future of the franchise. I know the issue is the statement that is made by paying too much for an unproven rookie and the fact that it gets worse every year.

I was commenting from a fan perspective not a message board icon who knows every aspect of the NFL business. As a fan, I believe that whether Harvey "wins" or the Jags hold their ground, I just want him on the field.

RE: Harvey the only one....

Jakobe911 — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 13:21:25 GMT

M[/quote]

What's this "we" all about? I don't pay his salary and neither do you. [/quote]

so what does pay the player salaries, all of that money from beer sales?? :D

RE: Harvey the only one....

Gabe — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 13:16:39 GMT

RE: Harvey the only one....

Totentanz — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 13:10:45 GMT

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Harvey gets signed next week. Bank on it.

RE: Harvey the only one....

ThanksJags — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 13:08:07 GMT

[quote][b]MRomeo (8/6/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]ThanksJags (8/5/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]mcol126 (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]I think this is a metaphor for the 2009-2009 season: The Jaguars will be the last man standing.[/quote]

I like it.

Honestly, I hope they overpaid Rivers so there is only a small window between 7 and 9. It could force the jags to accept the price tag and move on.[/quote]

You have to be kidding me. Don't you understand what it means if the jags are forced to accept the price tag of the #7 pick?

Jones-Drew is up for a new contract after next year, if we pay #7 pick money, guess what there's no money to pay MJD. Or money to pay Reggie Williams, or any of the other players coming up for a contract in the next year or two.

Why should we be willing to sacrifice the future of this team for one player who has yet to prove himself? Makes no sense to me.

Explain if you will what benefit to the JAGUARS it will be to sign Derrick Harvey to a huge contract? What do you think the long term benefits and risks and rewards might be.

M[/quote]

RE: Harvey the only one....

PF* — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 09:31:37 GMT

Exactly, exactly, exactly. I say take the phone off the hook, let him sit out and re-enter the draft next year. Teams will look back to that WR from SoCal who sat out a year, Mike Williams, and be very leery of drafting him too high. Enjoy your 300K next year, Derrick. Use some of it to buy your agent a Thank You card.

It's also too bad that you'll miss the opportunity to work for Jack Del Rio and Gregg Williams who would've turned you into a star. Oh, and be VERY careful you don't get injured between now and next year's draft!

Go Jags!

RE: Harvey the only one....

MRomeo — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 09:19:15 GMT

[quote][b]ThanksJags (8/5/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]mcol126 (8/5/2008)[/b][hr]I think this is a metaphor for the 2009-2009 season: The Jaguars will be the last man standing.[/quote]

I like it.

Honestly, I hope they overpaid Rivers so there is only a small window between 7 and 9. It could force the jags to accept the price tag and move on.[/quote]

You have to be kidding me. Don't you understand what it means if the jags are forced to accept the price tag of the #7 pick?

Jones-Drew is up for a new contract after next year, if we pay #7 pick money, guess what there's no money to pay MJD. Or money to pay Reggie Williams, or any of the other players coming up for a contract in the next year or two.

Why should we be willing to sacrifice the future of this team for one player who has yet to prove himself? Makes no sense to me.

Explain if you will what benefit to the JAGUARS it will be to sign Derrick Harvey to a huge contract? What do you think the long term benefits and risks and rewards might be.

M