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RE: Future NFL Stars

Chooch — Mon, 27 Oct 2008 09:49:02 GMT

[quote][b]CrackMonster (10/25/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/24/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]CrackMonster (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]AllTealAllReal (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]brianhalv (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

In the 4 games they lost the Saint's D gave up 29, 34, 30, and30 points. THAT is why they are losing. How can you put that on Bush's shoulders?[/quote]

Because if they had drafted a stud defensive player with the second overall pick they'd be better?[/quote]

How do you know their DB's wouldn't get burned?

They have a less than stellar backfield and you can't deny Bush isn't good.

As long as you use him to his strengths, then he will prosper but pounding the ball isn't his forte.[/quote]

That's exactly my point and I am glad that you brought that up.

You select a player in the Top Two picks, he better not have any glaring weaknesses, and if he does, then his strengths had better be enough to overshadow them. I am not saying that Bush is a bad player, I am saying that he is waaaaayyyyy over-drafted for what he can do.[/quote]

Eh, hind-sight is 20/20 but Bush is the definition of a playmaker, [b]a guy who has the ability to take over a game if used to his strengths.[/b] Now, taking that into consideration and understand that he isn't favorable as a #1 back and his draft status doesn't reflect the value at hand but Bush is very shifty in the catching game, the other day, he broke the record for 2nd fastest to catch 200 passes, and he is dangerous in the open field, making teams respect New Orleans' passing game as well as it's return game with Bush as the primary focus.

But I do agree that he shouldn't have been drafted so high, but he's still a good player no matter what with the exception of the run game with Bush as the carrier. At least New Orleans got some compensation from its draft blunder...[/quote]

To me, that is not a playmaker. A playmaker is a guy that takes over a game, period. If you can't line up a Running Back to run the ball in order close out the game in the Fourth, then wouldn't you consider his value is lessened?

Yeah, he's a great punt returner, so is Devin Hester that was drafted in the Second Round. I'm sorry, I am just not buying the idea that the #2 overall pick is a specialty player that can't be counted on late in a game is a good player.

RE: Future NFL Stars

CrackMonster — Sat, 25 Oct 2008 00:07:57 GMT

[quote][b]Chooch (10/24/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]CrackMonster (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]AllTealAllReal (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]brianhalv (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

In the 4 games they lost the Saint's D gave up 29, 34, 30, and30 points. THAT is why they are losing. How can you put that on Bush's shoulders?[/quote]

Because if they had drafted a stud defensive player with the second overall pick they'd be better?[/quote]

How do you know their DB's wouldn't get burned?

They have a less than stellar backfield and you can't deny Bush isn't good.

As long as you use him to his strengths, then he will prosper but pounding the ball isn't his forte.[/quote]

That's exactly my point and I am glad that you brought that up.

You select a player in the Top Two picks, he better not have any glaring weaknesses, and if he does, then his strengths had better be enough to overshadow them. I am not saying that Bush is a bad player, I am saying that he is waaaaayyyyy over-drafted for what he can do.[/quote]

Eh, hind-sight is 20/20 but Bush is the definition of a playmaker, a guy who has the ability to take over a game if used to his strengths. Now, taking that into consideration and understand that he isn't favorable as a #1 back and his draft status doesn't reflect the value at hand but Bush is very shifty in the catching game, the other day, he broke the record for 2nd fastest to catch 200 passes, and he is dangerous in the open field, making teams respect New Orleans' passing game as well as it's return game with Bush as the primary focus.

But I do agree that he shouldn't have been drafted so high, but he's still a good player no matter what with the exception of the run game with Bush as the carrier. At least New Orleans got some compensation from its draft blunder...

RE: Future NFL Stars

Chooch — Fri, 24 Oct 2008 12:16:48 GMT

[quote][b]CrackMonster (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]AllTealAllReal (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]brianhalv (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

In the 4 games they lost the Saint's D gave up 29, 34, 30, and30 points. THAT is why they are losing. How can you put that on Bush's shoulders?[/quote]

Because if they had drafted a stud defensive player with the second overall pick they'd be better?[/quote]

How do you know their DB's wouldn't get burned?

They have a less than stellar backfield and you can't deny Bush isn't good.

As long as you use him to his strengths, then he will prosper but pounding the ball isn't his forte.[/quote]

That's exactly my point and I am glad that you brought that up.

You select a player in the Top Two picks, he better not have any glaring weaknesses, and if he does, then his strengths had better be enough to overshadow them. I am not saying that Bush is a bad player, I am saying that he is waaaaayyyyy over-drafted for what he can do.

RE: Future NFL Stars

razorbackman4life — Thu, 23 Oct 2008 19:54:33 GMT

Brian Orakpo is a beast, I think he will.

and Bush IS tied with LenDale White for most TDs in the NFL with 8...this season he's been above average

RE: Future NFL Stars

CrackMonster — Thu, 23 Oct 2008 18:58:20 GMT

[quote][b]AllTealAllReal (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]brianhalv (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

In the 4 games they lost the Saint's D gave up 29, 34, 30, and30 points. THAT is why they are losing. How can you put that on Bush's shoulders?[/quote]

Because if they had drafted a stud defensive player with the second overall pick they'd be better?[/quote]

How do you know their DB's wouldn't get burned?

They have a less than stellar backfield and you can't deny Bush isn't good.

As long as you use him to his strengths, then he will prosper but pounding the ball isn't his forte.

RE: Future NFL Stars

AllTealAllReal — Thu, 23 Oct 2008 18:35:25 GMT

[quote][b]brianhalv (10/23/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

In the 4 games they lost the Saint's D gave up 29, 34, 30, and 30 points. THAT is why they are losing. How can you put that on Bush's shoulders?[/quote]

Because if they had drafted a stud defensive player with the second overall pick they'd be better?

RE: Future NFL Stars

brianhalv — Thu, 23 Oct 2008 18:21:39 GMT

[quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

In the 4 games they lost the Saint's D gave up 29, 34, 30, and 30 points. THAT is why they are losing. How can you put that on Bush's shoulders?

RE: Future NFL Stars

MJD=MVP2007 — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 11:21:50 GMT

[quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]MJD=MVP2007 (10/22/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

You can't deny his game changing ability.........look at the Vikings game[/quote]

And I am not, there are a lot of players that change the game, but where is the effectiveness of it? When NO had the ball with 7:06 left in that game with a tie score, why couldn't they finish it off the way that Jacksonville did vs. Denver? In that possession, R. Bush had a total of 1 yard of Offense in two touches.

Are we really justifying that a player taken in the top two selections of a draft can't be counted on in the bottom half of the last quarter of a game because it's not his forte? To me, that seems ridiculous. When the team needed him to make a play that would seal the game, he came up short.

Does that seem like value to you?[/quote]

The only reason they were in the game was because he ran two punts back

RE: Future NFL Stars

Chooch — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 10:43:50 GMT

[quote][b]MJD=MVP2007 (10/22/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?[/quote]

You can't deny his game changing ability.........look at the Vikings game[/quote]

And I am not, there are a lot of players that change the game, but where is the effectiveness of it? When NO had the ball with 7:06 left in that game with a tie score, why couldn't they finish it off the way that Jacksonville did vs. Denver? In that possession, R. Bush had a total of 1 yard of Offense in two touches.

Are we really justifying that a player taken in the top two selections of a draft can't be counted on in the bottom half of the last quarter of a game because it's not his forte? To me, that seems ridiculous. When the team needed him to make a play that would seal the game, he came up short.

Does that seem like value to you?

RE: Future NFL Stars

MJD=MVP2007 — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 10:31:57 GMT

You can't deny his game changing ability.........look at the Vikings game

RE: Future NFL Stars

Chooch — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 08:02:32 GMT

Yeah, and the team that he is on is in last place in the NFC South, has a 3-4 record, and Reggie Bush has been the top rusher in 1 game this season, 9/21 vs. Denver.

If he was drafted to be a game changer, why does New Orleans keep on losing?

RE: Future NFL Stars

brianhalv — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 02:58:05 GMT

Called for.

RE: Future NFL Stars

Its Meier Time — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 02:29:45 GMT

[quote][b]brianhalv (10/22/2008)[/b][hr]Would you guys still say Bush isn't excelling at the role he was drafted for? The Saint's are the league's #1 offense. A large part of this is due to the fact Brees is playing lights out, but the way Bush is opening the field can't be ignored.

He is on pace for over 1,500 rushing/receiving yards and 18 total touchdowns.
Combine this with the fact that he is completely dominating everybody else in punt returns.
1. Reggie Bush AVG 21.9 3 TDs
2. Roscoe Parrish AVG 14.3 1 TD
3. Eddie Royal AVG 13.6 0 TD

I think you guys need to eat some more crow.
[/quote]

Three and a half month bump.

Wow.

RE: Future NFL Stars

brianhalv — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 02:24:37 GMT

Would you guys still say Bush isn't excelling at the role he was drafted for? The Saint's are the league's #1 offense. A large part of this is due to the fact Brees is playing lights out, but the way Bush is opening the field can't be ignored.

He is on pace for over 1,500 rushing/receiving yards and 18 total touchdowns.
Combine this with the fact that he is completely dominating everybody else in punt returns.
1. Reggie Bush AVG 21.9 3 TDs
2. Roscoe Parrish AVG 14.3 1 TD
3. Eddie Royal AVG 13.6 0 TD

I think you guys need to eat some more crow.

RE: Future NFL Stars

KingIngram052787 — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 12:04:01 GMT

[quote][b]TheSpacePope (7/3/2008)[/b][hr]My initial post was in response to someone saying that Reggie Bush is a current "star player" in the National Football League.

He's about the furthest thing you can be from a star.. so he sucks.

One over-exaggeration deserves another.[/quote]

I disagree, he's still a "star," just not a good one. He's extremely famous and all...:unsure:

RE: Future NFL Stars

TheSpacePope — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 01:22:39 GMT

My initial post was in response to someone saying that Reggie Bush is a current "star player" in the National Football League.

He's about the furthest thing you can be from a star.. so he sucks.

One over-exaggeration deserves another.

RE: Future NFL Stars

brianhalv — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 01:16:03 GMT

[quote][b]TheSpacePope (7/1/2008)[/b][hr]Compared to the hype by all the "experts" and the reality of his play, he sucks.

He has millions and millions of dollars based on that hype and nothing else; I think that sucks too.[/quote]

Read my initial posts. I know he has UNDER achieved from the "2nd coming" hype Bush had. However, he does not "suck". Hype, name, history aside, Bush is an average player, at worst, and does have upside.

RE: Future NFL Stars

BigJohn98 — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 23:05:01 GMT

Ricky Sapp.

From what I've read on message boards, Allen Bailey is a freak of nature.

RE: Future NFL Stars

Big John — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 22:43:51 GMT

[quote][b]mjdfan87 (7/2/2008)[/b][hr]I think Mike Crabtree is doing well because of the system at Texas Tech.

One guy to look at is Mark Sanchez QB USC. I think he is a better prospect than Booty and Leinart. Sanchez could be a second round/ late first next year.[/quote]

I used to think that about Crabtree then I saw that he was a good recruit which usually doesn't happen with TT receivers. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

Another receiver that could be special...Jeremy Macklin.

RE: Future NFL Stars

Big John — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 22:40:10 GMT

[quote][b]KingIngram052787 (7/2/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Big John (7/1/2008)[/b][hr]Let's not turn this into a Leftwich or Reggie Bush thread...

Some guys I think have "star" power at the next level...I'm gonna skip the obvious ones like Percy and Knowshon

Andre Smith- OT- Bama
DeMarco Murray-RB-Oklahoma
Everson Griffen-DE-Southern Cal
Marvin Austin-DT-UNC
Martez Wilson-DE/OLB-Illinois
Arrelious Benn-WR-Illinois
Eric Berry-CB/S-Tennessee
Carlos Dunlap-DE-Florida

*Sleeper/Homer pick* Dekota Watson-LB-FSU

[/quote]

I could go pick every 5 star highschool recruit and list them too....I was gonna list Dekota also...

Edit: Homer pick #2 Patrick Robinson-CB-FSU[/quote]

Lol. That's why recruiting is so important!!

RE: Future NFL Stars

mjdfan87 — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 20:39:33 GMT

I think Mike Crabtree is doing well because of the system at Texas Tech.

One guy to look at is Mark Sanchez QB USC. I think he is a better prospect than Booty and Leinart. Sanchez could be a second round/ late first next year.

RE: Future NFL Stars

Chooch — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 14:27:25 GMT

[quote][b]jagabc6893 (7/2/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Chooch (7/2/2008)[/b][hr]...

[/quote]

... I'm not so sure about RB Moreno in the NFL though. I could end up being wrong, but something tells me Stafford will be a much better NFL player.

WR Mike Crabtree could be a terror when he gets to the NFL. Chris Wells looks to be a Fred Taylor clone in size/speed combo. I know Fred is faster, but wells will be good.[/quote]

I agree with you regarding Moreno. For some reason, he just seems little to me, and not in the stocky way that M. Jones-Drew does. He just looks like he won't be able to take the beating that comes along with being an NFL RB.

RE: Future NFL Stars

jagabc6893 — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 13:16:39 GMT

[quote][b]Chooch (7/2/2008)[/b][hr]I think that Matthew Stafford, QB from UGA will have a good career in the NFL. He's got decent size, a good arm, and he's smart.

I also like Brian Robiskie, WR from Ohio State. he's not the fastest thing out there, but he's as dependable as they come.

[/quote]

Ditto on Matt Stafford from Georgia. I was going to bring him up. Once he gets in an NFL passing system, he will be better able to utilize his skill and arm strength, so he should excel at the next level. Sort of like Cutler from Vandy to NFL. Speaking of UGA, I'm not so sure about RB Moreno in the NFL though. I could end up being wrong, but something tells me Stafford will be a much better NFL player.

WR Mike Crabtree could be a terror when he gets to the NFL. Chris Wells looks to be a Fred Taylor clone in size/speed combo. I know Fred is faster, but wells will be good.

RE: Future NFL Stars

LMD — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 12:07:23 GMT

The lack of Sam Mcguffie in this thread is disheartening.

RE: Future NFL Stars

KingIngram052787 — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 11:44:43 GMT

[quote][b]Big John (7/1/2008)[/b][hr]Let's not turn this into a Leftwich or Reggie Bush thread...

Some guys I think have "star" power at the next level...I'm gonna skip the obvious ones like Percy and Knowshon

Andre Smith- OT- Bama
DeMarco Murray-RB-Oklahoma
Everson Griffen-DE-Southern Cal
Marvin Austin-DT-UNC
Martez Wilson-DE/OLB-Illinois
Arrelious Benn-WR-Illinois
Eric Berry-CB/S-Tennessee
Carlos Dunlap-DE-Florida

*Sleeper/Homer pick* Dekota Watson-LB-FSU

[/quote]

I could go pick every 5 star highschool recruit and list them too....I was gonna list Dekota also...

Edit: Homer pick #2 Patrick Robinson-CB-FSU

RE: Future NFL Stars

Chooch — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 09:00:00 GMT

I think that Matthew Stafford, QB from UGA will have a good career in the NFL. He's got decent size, a good arm, and he's smart.

I also like Brian Robiskie, WR from Ohio State. he's not the fastest thing out there, but he's as dependable as they come.

RE: Future NFL Stars

BASE_D — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 00:40:36 GMT

No love for Ohio state's Chris "Beanie" Wells? A power RB with legit 4.4 speed? He's definately going to be another rookie RB that rips it up

RE: Future NFL Stars

Big John — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 23:33:21 GMT

Let's not turn this into a Leftwich or Reggie Bush thread...

Some guys I think have "star" power at the next level...I'm gonna skip the obvious ones like Percy and Knowshon

Andre Smith- OT- Bama
DeMarco Murray-RB-Oklahoma
Everson Griffen-DE-Southern Cal
Marvin Austin-DT-UNC
Martez Wilson-DE/OLB-Illinois
Arrelious Benn-WR-Illinois
Eric Berry-CB/S-Tennessee
Carlos Dunlap-DE-Florida

*Sleeper/Homer pick* Dekota Watson-LB-FSU

RE: Future NFL Stars

Joe Six-Pack — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 23:32:19 GMT

[quote][b]brianhalv (7/1/2008)[/b][hr]You wouldn't be content with your running back averaging 1,150 AP yards per season?

You're stupid. Quit.[/quote]

Jones-Drew has had over 2,000 in 2 straight seasons.

Compared to what Bush was expected to be, he has disappointed. The hype machine for this guy was crazy.

RBs taken that early are expected to transition well and in a quick manner.

There is a slight level of suckdom.. IMO. However, he can change that..

RE: Future NFL Stars

TheSpacePope — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 23:22:42 GMT

Compared to the hype by all the "experts" and the reality of his play, he sucks.

He has millions and millions of dollars based on that hype and nothing else; I think that sucks too.

RE: Future NFL Stars

brianhalv — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 23:20:07 GMT

Sir, you just stated yourself that Reggie Bush is a mediocre player. So you agree with me that he does not suck?

I'm not claiming Bush is GOOD, just that he doesn't suck.

RE: Future NFL Stars

The Mad Dog — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 22:03:23 GMT

[quote][b]TheSpacePope (7/1/2008)[/b][hr]

You sound like DM13.. mancrush on a mediocre player.[/quote]

kinda like 70% of this MB's mancrush on LeftTown....he wa a mediocre player too.

RE: Future NFL Stars

Bon Jagley — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 21:27:07 GMT

DaQuan Bowers

RE: Future NFL Stars

KingIngram052787 — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 20:03:30 GMT

I'm sure UM has a TE...I'm not even gonna bother looking it up.

RE: Future NFL Stars

Duvalbill — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 19:35:30 GMT

Getting back to the topic at hand.

Joe McNight looks every part of a future NFL Star.

If Percy Harvin can be durable he could be a star.

Noel Devine is kind of in the mold of Warrick Dunn.

RE: Future NFL Stars

TheSpacePope — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 19:05:15 GMT

3.6 YPC as a rookie
3.7 YPC in his second year

so he should be respectable in about 10 seasons.

He's used as a WR.. and his average is below 9 YPC. That's SAD!

His longest rush as a rookie? 22.
His longest rush in his second year? 17.

20+ yard rushes in his career? 3.

20+ yard catches in his career? 6.

He's pathetic in the role he's supposed to excel at in your eyes.

RE: Future NFL Stars

TheSpacePope — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 19:00:07 GMT

Hell no.

If he can't run, I don't want him. And Reggie Bush can't run.

You sound like DM13.. mancrush on a mediocre player.

RE: Future NFL Stars

rfc17 — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 18:33:22 GMT

I have my reservations about Spiller. He has the great speed but im not sure he has great vision. i bet he'd be real tough playing for the Broncos but I wonder how he'd do with us.

RE: Future NFL Stars

brianhalv — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 18:02:59 GMT

[quote][b]TheSpacePope (7/1/2008)[/b][hr]He does suck.

And defensive coordinators LAUGH at people like you. Some have gone on the record as saying that they don't factor Reggie Bush at all. He's that meaningless.

That's what Bush fans say all the time.. well he has to be accounted for and he opens things up.
NO HE DOESN'T. Their 7th round pick garners more attention.

He can't run between the tackles to save his life.

He makes those yards from 5 yard dumpoffs that he gets .2 YAC from about 90 times a season. It makes it look much more impressive than it is. They made a huge mistake drafting him.. he should have been a 3rd round pick at the highest.[/quote]

By the way, he gets 7 yards after the catch, not .2.

RE: Future NFL Stars

brianhalv — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 18:01:59 GMT

You wouldn't be content with your running back averaging 1,150 AP yards per season?

You're stupid. Quit.